ben
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 10:36:35 GMT
Hey everyone.
Lately i was scratching my head around on how to make my 1/3 Tangible waves and 2/3 DIY modular setup to have a juicy low end bass sound. For now it sounds great for some lead sounds etc., but what about bass sound? I've tried to lower the coarse frequency on AE's VCO module and hooked it to Keystep for pitch control - still can't get that bassy sound, or at the low end it becomes a bit noisy or just starts to go under the audio range and becomes an LFO. Tried with a different waveforms and filters - still, can't get near that beefy sound. Maybe it's all about filters(!?)
Any ideas? What filter do you use or do you combine a few waveforms or what's your approach?
Would love to hear different thoughts and takes!
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Post by NightMachines on Dec 3, 2019 11:01:04 GMT
I think filters are very important indeed. When I first received my AE Modular I also had a feeling that creating bass sounds was different somehow. I believe it was because I wasn’t used to the WASP and NYLE filters. The WASP design for example loses bottom end with increased resonance (similar to a 303 filter). To get a thicker bottom end, mixing a triangle or sine wave with a pulse wave can also work well. You can of course shape a pulse wave into somewhat of a sine with a low-resonance LPF.
EDIT: Envelopes are important too to shape the filter sound over a note’s time. So try adding a decay ENV to the filter cutoff as well as to the VCA.
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Post by Gaëtan on Dec 3, 2019 11:39:58 GMT
Should this be moved to "AE Modular talk" ?
Anyway, I have found that the sub output from the 2osc/d really helps giving some bottom end to the sound when mixed with the other waveforms. Other than that it quite comes with finding the sweet spots on the filters. I have the SV and Wasp filter and they are not easy to tame, you need to fiddle a bit to find the right cutoff and resonance values, as well as the right amount of envelope.
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ben
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Posts: 124
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 11:59:46 GMT
I think filters are very important indeed. When I first received my AE Modular I also had a feeling that creating bass sounds was different somehow. I believe it was because I wasn’t used to the WASP and NYLE filters. The WASP design for example loses bottom end with increased resonance (similar to a 303 filter). To get a thicker bottom end, mixing a triangle or sine wave with a pulse wave can also work well. You can of course shape a pulse wave into somewhat of a sine with a low-resonance LPF. EDIT: Envelopes are important too to shape the filter sound over a note’s time. So try adding a decay ENV to the filter cutoff as well as to the VCA. Thanks for the tips Yeah I have WASP filter and this is not the right choice for beefy bass sound.. Perhaps will have to work more on DIY filters or just grab Nyle filter from AE shop. And will have to test mixing pulse wave with triangle as advised.
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ben
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Posts: 124
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 12:08:07 GMT
Should this be moved to "AE Modular talk" ?
Anyway, I have found that the sub output from the 2osc/d really helps giving some bottom end to the sound when mixed with the other waveforms. Other than that it quite comes with finding the sweet spots on the filters. I have the SV and Wasp filter and they are not easy to tame, you need to fiddle a bit to find the right cutoff and resonance values, as well as the right amount of envelope.
Yeah I thought at first, but then decided to keep it here, maybe any DIY projects would come up of it. I tried feeding oscillator to a simple clock divider (IC4040 chip) to get an octave or two down, the only thing is that it outputs only square wave (..I believe), so it requires additional signal filtering. Don't have a 2OSC/d module, just tried to work around with something similar. Here I found a nice sounding relatively simple DIY synth project with a lovely filter:
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Post by NightMachines on Dec 3, 2019 13:36:06 GMT
Used my lunch break to film a quick bass sound demo (decent speakers or headphones necessary of course): YouTube Link
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ben
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Posts: 124
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 14:04:32 GMT
Used my lunch break to film a quick bass sound demo (decent speakers or headphones necessary of course): YouTube Link awesome! Thanks for the video. Was thinking to get a Wavefolder, you've made this choice pretty clear now
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ben
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Posts: 124
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 14:08:18 GMT
btw, NightMachines, there's something out of topic, but still - is it "normal" that the output signal from a master module is very low? If I plug it to my mixer I can barely hear anything. I've got a very simple passive noise-cancelling gadget from eBay with mini jacks for input and output, if I plug it before sending the signal to the mixer - it sounds way louder than without.
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Post by NightMachines on Dec 3, 2019 14:17:01 GMT
btw, NightMachines , there's something out of topic, but still - is it "normal" that the output signal from a master module is very low? If I plug it to my mixer I can barely hear anything. I've got a very simple passive noise-cancelling gadget from eBay with mini jacks for input and output, if I plug it before sending the signal to the mixer - it sounds way louder than without. That’s strange. The volume should be plenty for line level mixers. Maybe there is a grounding issue? Are you using a proper TS (mono) jack cable to connect the MASTER I/O to your mixer? EDIT: I moved the thread to "AE Modular Talk"
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ben
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Posts: 124
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Post by ben on Dec 3, 2019 15:23:12 GMT
btw, NightMachines , there's something out of topic, but still - is it "normal" that the output signal from a master module is very low? If I plug it to my mixer I can barely hear anything. I've got a very simple passive noise-cancelling gadget from eBay with mini jacks for input and output, if I plug it before sending the signal to the mixer - it sounds way louder than without. That’s strange. The volume should be plenty for line level mixers. Maybe there is a grounding issue? Are you using a proper TS (mono) jack cable to connect the MASTER I/O to your mixer? EDIT: I moved the thread to "AE Modular Talk" Yeah I've tried with a few different setups and cables. Still the same. I bought this Master module (pre-installed in a rack) back in 2018, maybe there were some issues in a certain batch with these modules? had you heard anything related to that? Maybe I could just try to open the module and check all the connections myself. EDIT: OMG! NightMachines! I'm dumb. All the time I was using only stereo mini jacks from Master module. Even if on the other end it's mono - it still doesn't work (well it works, but very quietly). Now checked with eurorack cable - all works fine - loud and clear. And I've spent more than a year thinking that it's "ok"...
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Lugia
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Post by Lugia on Dec 4, 2019 0:38:44 GMT
Now that that's solved...back to bass...
Actually, a really good method for creating a plunky, fat bass sound would be to use TWO filters. One of these (your pick, although my vote goes for the NYLE) is there to control the overall tone of the sound, but other, which should be a low-pass gate (which also works as a VCA) is there for the actual dynamic contour + the final timbral contour. So once the overall timbre gets rounded-out by the VCF, the signal hits the LPG which adds the punchy dynamic and bass aspect. This method should work even better once Robert gets the VCADSR module out the door, as that'll give you a sustain level which can keep the LPG partly open to extend the note's rhythmic value until the note is released.
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Post by slowscape on Dec 4, 2019 21:14:37 GMT
I really like the sound from night machines, and am looking forward to receiving my wave folder which I currently have on order.
I've been able to get some really nice bass sounds simply out of the WASP + square wave with just the right settings. There's a sweet spot you have to hit.
Check out any of my videos, they all use the WASP plus a square wave alone for bass lines. And for the beat, I'm usually hitting the filter with an ENV.
Have to make do with a minimalist setup! It's been a lot of fun working around different limitations.
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thundersound
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A modular world .. from Aa to Thunder and beyond
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Post by thundersound on Jan 2, 2020 21:47:36 GMT
Used my lunch break to film a quick bass sound demo (decent speakers or headphones necessary of course): YouTube LinkHah, nice instruction video, I was also searching for a solution for this, I have in my eurorack 2 good sub modules, but also wanted a solution in AE. I have not all modules yet, but so I have a good guide for buying the next modules Would go well with the kick module I think .. but, although.. need to buy a new kick I think, because the new one is some better again Anyway, thanks for the video NiMach..
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thundersound
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A modular world .. from Aa to Thunder and beyond
Posts: 82
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Post by thundersound on Mar 5, 2020 12:52:32 GMT
Used my lunch break to film a quick bass sound demo (decent speakers or headphones necessary of course): YouTube LinkThanks TNM for the video. There was 1 thing I was thinking about, you take the normal VCO as base for the bass. But the 2OSC/D has a sub-octave output, would that not provide a good base for the bass ?
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Post by NightMachines on Mar 5, 2020 13:22:47 GMT
There was 1 thing I was thinking about, you take the normal VCO as base for the bass. But the 2OSC/D has a sub-octave output, would that not provide a good base for the bass ? Sure, I don‘t own a 2OSC/D, but I assume the sub output would be very useful for bass sounds too. Especially mixing the sub and regular outputs (even sent through separate filters) might be cool to try!
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Post by Gaëtan on Mar 5, 2020 13:25:55 GMT
Yes I wrote it a bit above, mixing the sub oscillator works great to give some punch to a bass sound.
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thundersound
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A modular world .. from Aa to Thunder and beyond
Posts: 82
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Post by thundersound on Mar 5, 2020 15:59:57 GMT
There was 1 thing I was thinking about, you take the normal VCO as base for the bass. But the 2OSC/D has a sub-octave output, would that not provide a good base for the bass ? Sure, I don‘t own a 2OSC/D, but I assume the sub output would be very useful for bass sounds too. Especially mixing the sub and regular outputs (even sent through separate filters) might be cool to try! Ah ok ) I also do not posess it yet, but it made it on my witsh-list now..
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Post by arti on Mar 5, 2020 17:02:43 GMT
From my experience Kick can be used to create realy fat bass. I send it to Wavefolder, Wasp filter (which CV was modulated by SEQ16) and Delay plus long envelope. This enhance the possible use of Kick which may add really nice sound
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thundersound
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A modular world .. from Aa to Thunder and beyond
Posts: 82
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Post by thundersound on Mar 5, 2020 22:31:43 GMT
From my experience Kick can be used to create realy fat bass. I send it to Wavefolder, Wasp filter (which CV was modulated by SEQ16) and Delay plus long envelope. This enhance the possible use of Kick which may add really nice sound Ha Nice, I was also thinking about that, but had not test it yet.. Do you have the new version ? I have the old version myself. Robert said that the new version should have even more sub-bass.. I am thinking about also geting the new version.
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Post by arti on Mar 6, 2020 13:43:45 GMT
From my experience Kick can be used to create realy fat bass. I send it to Wavefolder, Wasp filter (which CV was modulated by SEQ16) and Delay plus long envelope. This enhance the possible use of Kick which may add really nice sound Ha Nice, I was also thinking about that, but had not test it yet.. Do you have the new version ? I have the old version myself. Robert said that the new version should have even more sub-bass.. I am thinking about also geting the new version. I'm not sue which module are You reffering to asking about old or new version, nevertheless all modules I've mentioned are early versions.
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thundersound
Junior Member
A modular world .. from Aa to Thunder and beyond
Posts: 82
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Post by thundersound on Mar 6, 2020 13:54:28 GMT
Ha Nice, I was also thinking about that, but had not test it yet.. Do you have the new version ? I have the old version myself. Robert said that the new version should have even more sub-bass.. I am thinking about also geting the new version. I'm not sue which module are You reffering to asking about old or new version, nevertheless all modules I've mentioned are early versions. I meant the kick module. It is not an old module, but even then there was alreade a new version, as I understand.
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ean
New Member
Posts: 34
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Post by ean on Mar 14, 2020 12:02:38 GMT
I like going out the ae modular into distortions. I was happy to hear the filters have a lot of sweet spots and even tiny adjustments to env/ filt/ vca can really change the sound. I like the fact the bass is a little bit tighter to my ear on the ae. I think it's a good sound allows it to sit with other synths. I also like sending 2 or more oscs to the mixer to detune them. I send all the outs of the svf to a mixer and balance the sound.
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pol
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Post by pol on Mar 26, 2020 8:24:57 GMT
From my experience Kick can be used to create realy fat bass. I send it to Wavefolder, Wasp filter (which CV was modulated by SEQ16) and Delay plus long envelope. This enhance the possible use of Kick which may add really nice sound I got a really good. deep, heavy bass sound with the AE using the Kick module through the Nyle Filter. :-)
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Post by arti on Apr 15, 2020 16:09:18 GMT
I've turned AEM into bass synth and I've got REALLY satisfying bass sound with many modulation possibilities sending buffed up square wave into two different routings with different means of modulation along the way, to combine them finaly in the mixer. One was send to wasp and wavefolder the other was sole wasp (another one) or combined with Nyle. With the knob action here and there it made a wide scope from deep sub-bass through more clean sound and then rich, fat, dirty, juicy, plucky sound until full blown acid resonance. No external FX, just the touch of DELAY module. Check out my AEM bass feast And here are all the details of the patch: 2OSC {pulsewidth at 12 o'clock/ freg1 at 2 o'clock} sawtooth -> VCO cv VCO {mod at 3 -switched to freq/coarse freq at 7/fine freq at 12/pulsewidth at 9} square1 ->WASP1 in VCO {knobs as stated above} square2 ->WASP2 in LFO1 {switched on fast sawtooth/rate at 1/pulsewidth at 10}sawtooth -> WASP2 cv1 LFO2 {switched on slow triangle/rate at 5/pulsewidth at 7} triangle ->BEAT DIVIDER clk WASP1 {freq between 10-12/cv between 9-12/resonance between 7-5} LP -> 2VCA in1 WASP2 {freq between 10-12/cv between 9-12/resonance between 7-5} LP -> 2VCA in2 ENV {attack slightly past 7/Decay at 10} out1-> 2VCA in1 ENV {knobs as stated above} out2-> 2VCA in2 ENV {knobs as stated above} out3-> LFO1 sync 2VCA {cv1 at 5/cv2 at 5} out1->WAVEFOLDER in 2VCA {knobs as above} out2-> NYLE lp in 2VCA {knobs as above} out2-> 3VCSWITCH 1a NYLE FILTER {lowpass,bandpass,highpass, cv1, cv2 at 5/frequency at 10-12/resonace at 2- sligthly before screaming} out->3VCSWITCH 1b BEAT DIVIDER {div at 1/32, triplet} out b -> STEP10 clk STEP10 {set to 10} 10 -> SEQ16 reset SEQ16 {cv range 2,5-5/ knobs as on the photo in the link} cv -> VCO mod SEQ16 {as above} gate -> ENV gt1 SEQ16 {as above} accent -> WASP1 cv1 WAVEFOLDER {drive between 9-3/shape cv at 8/shape at 12) out -> DELAY in DELAY {delay time at 12/feedback at 7/ dry-wet between 9-11} out -> MIXER4-4 a2 3VCSWITCH io1 {latch switched manualy as gate trigger} -> MIXER 4-4 a1 MIXER 4-4 {level a1, level a2 at 7-5} out a ->MASTER audio1 I/O MIXER 4-4 {as above} out b ->MASTER audio2 I/O Unexpected part of the patch was pitch control of the melody via mod knob on VCO, but couldn't get really low bass sound by patching cv SEQ16 output to usual CV inputs of VCOs, nor wasn't able to play melodies sending it to the WASP cv, so I've accidentaly found another way to do it . The BEAT DIVIDER combined with STEP10 was used to expand the length of the SEQ16 sequence by resetting the sequencer after every 20 steps. Of course it was adjustable by BEAT DIVIDER resolution settings, but I left it untouched during play. I like and often use this trick. I was amazed by the wide palette of bass sounds, I think everyone should find a sweat spot to their liking within AEM bass range. Another surprise was that without using KICK, which was my usual way to get bass sounds I managed to carve very deep low sound. (I would say it bears some similiarities with DAF sound!) One of the routings wasn't even going through WAVEFOLDER and still was able to produce valuable contribution to the bass variety. Once again AEM prooved its flexibility <3
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Post by NightMachines on Apr 15, 2020 20:22:43 GMT
Wow! That bass feast audio is amazing! Well done!!!
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