pol
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Posts: 1,277
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Post by pol on Jul 10, 2022 14:06:49 GMT
I did this spreadsheet a few months ago to help decide which Mixer module I was going to get for my main audio mixer, having recently started using the 4MIX/FADER. It occured to me others may find it useful; I have only done parameters that were important to me/my decision, so you may still have to do your own research!
I ended up buying the MIxconsole as the CV control of channel level was crucial for what I want to do, now I wish I had CV control of stereo panning!
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Post by funbun on Jul 14, 2022 23:38:28 GMT
Nice comparison. I have the SV, wasp and the MS20. I like using self-resonance for accents via sample-and-hold. Thinking of changing for the Kuzmin and the Nyle. However, I find myself doing more west-coast synthesis, so a rectifier is really what I want.
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Post by pt3r on Jul 15, 2022 6:20:19 GMT
... I like using self-resonance for accents via sample-and-hold... Could you elaborate on that? |
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Post by maydonpoliris on Jul 15, 2022 9:48:04 GMT
... I like using self-resonance for accents via sample-and-hold... Could you elaborate on that? Yes please, this is sounding like an interesting tip funbun |
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Post by funbun on Jul 15, 2022 11:51:00 GMT
Oh, yes, a simple thing really. I don't use drum sounds at all, yet there is tons of rhythm in my patches. Part of what drives the rhythm is:
NOISE
/ \
(analog) \ \ TRIP, BEAT or MM Divider > SAMPLE-&-HOLD > 2ATT, VCA, any attentuator / \ (random) \ VCO > FILTER or WAVEFOLDER Select a filter that self-resonates or has a lot of "character." The WASP filter works well here even though it doesn't self-resonate well. From here set the resonance and CV such that the sample-and-hold makes accents, back beats and syncopation since it's all driven by the system clock. Here an example, fast forward to the 9 minute mark: blackwarriorlures.bandcamp.com/track/thirdsIf you listen to the solo voice, you can hear the sample and hold controlling the filter, and makes a kind of rhythm to what would otherwise be constant running eight notes. Just another way to add a subtle change to the sound to that it isn't the same thing all the time. |
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pol
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Post by pol on Jul 17, 2022 9:25:23 GMT
Just you haven't read the wiki page, this may help with this patching, 
"This module does not have CV control of resonance, but it can be created by putting one of the filter outputs through a VCA whose level is controlled by the CV modulation source (e.g. LFO or envelope), then feeding the VCA output back into the same filter - you may need a mixer module, or use a mult if necessary as the levels on the 2 inputs are different. Try the low input for the feed back from the VCA first.... "
It can be used to increase resoance too,  |
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Post by funbun on Jul 17, 2022 12:54:03 GMT
Ah, yes! Thank you! I'll have to try that. That should work much better.
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Post by chillja on Aug 15, 2022 12:31:40 GMT
"I ended up buying the MIxconsole as the CV control of channel level was crucial for what I want to do, now I wish I had CV control of stereo panning!"
Thanks for your comparison. Cv control of panning can somehow be achieved by using two mixconsole-mixer channels? Multing one audio source to each channel, panning them 100% left/right. Then using one cv signal to modulate the gain of one channel, and the same cv signal but inverted to modulate gain of the other channel (L/R)?
I have these four identical powered monitors and would love to do some quadraphonic effects with them, live. Brainstorming for some simple, basic and affordable solutions right now. I want cv control of panning between 4 speakers  
- I think "moco" maybe can be used to make a signal appear to be traveling round and round, with sawtooth cv input.
- qvca (i have one) is good for inverting cv signals for panning - maybe 2X mixconsole can work for panning 2X seperate sound sources across 4 speakers using the panning trick described above? - Also thinking something like "Herbs and Stones Pathways" (4ch matrix mixer with cv control) could send 4 seperate sound sources to 4 different speakers by cv control.
I tried to read about this on another forum and they talked about needing to have 6X vca to pan one sound.. still not get my head around it 
You see i'm just thinking out loud here, and will do some more research and planning before posting again. Maybe some of you have some experience doing quadraphonic sound, and especially within the AE-framework?
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chuck
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Post by chuck on Aug 15, 2022 14:00:15 GMT
I too want cv control of panning between four speakers... first order of business, I'm gonna have to get two more speakers.
Please keep us informed of your exploration of quadraphonic sound!
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Post by chillja on Aug 15, 2022 16:37:47 GMT
Thank's for your reply! I think i'm going to go the route of two mixconsoles for starters. I already have qvca and moco, and a mm33 (remains to be built). I'm not looking to do "realistic" spatial effects, but still be interesting nonetheless. After watching one of loopop's videos I realise the coolness of having parameters or amounts of FX linked in relation to the panning. Sounds quieter=more reverb, i.e. far way, Sound louder=less reverb, i.e close by. Some thoughts about ways to experiment with quadraphonic audio (using four speakers) with this basic "panning" rack. Each mixconsole outputs to front left/right and back left/right respectively:
- 2 cv pan-able tracks (trick with combining pairs of channels), or 4 manually pan-able and more stationary tracks. With possibilities for future 3ch expansions.
- by using the fx return tracks for additional audio in, I can either have a mono source like kick and bass equally loud on all speakers, or a balance between front pair and back pair using "fx rtn level" on each mixconsole. With 4 vca's inbetween source and mixer i would get additional cv pan-able tracks
- if I use the stereo fx return tracks for audio coming back in from an effect, but first sending the fx audio through 4 vca's before into the mixer's returns.. then i could use the main cv panning signals (or some relation thereof) to also open/close the vca's and get different amount of fx in each speakers.
- moco would be a start for generating some panning-cv. other ways to move sound with cv will have to be experimented with. Joystick comes to mind.
- mm33, let's see how it can fit into all of this;)
Will update and make a new thread to share some experiences later. |
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pol
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Post by pol on Aug 15, 2022 18:12:31 GMT
Thanks for your comparison. Cv control of panning can somehow be achieved by using two mixconsole-mixer channels? Multing one audio source to each channel, panning them 100% left/right. Then using one cv signal to modulate the gain of one channel, and the same cv signal but inverted to modulate gain of the other channel (L/R)?
Yes, this should/would work (be fun to try not just inverting the CV but having a serperate CV for each side and see what happens,
Unfortunately I need the 4 inputs already; can't afford to give 2 to one sound but that could be a reason to buy a Mixconsole/3CH expander or 2.... 
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Post by chillja on Aug 16, 2022 6:43:16 GMT
Thanks for your comparison. Cv control of panning can somehow be achieved by using two mixconsole-mixer channels? Multing one audio source to each channel, panning them 100% left/right. Then using one cv signal to modulate the gain of one channel, and the same cv signal but inverted to modulate gain of the other channel (L/R)?
Yes, this should/would work (be fun to try not just inverting the CV but having a serperate CV for each side and see what happens,
Unfortunately I need the 4 inputs already; can't afford to give 2 to one sound but that could be a reason to buy a Mixconsole/3CH expander or 2....
I read in the wiki that the ch. gain dials act as a "maximum cv input" controllers (the same as attenuators?) if cv present. With different cv to each channel this might be useful to dial in some balance to the panning-chaos:) |
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Post by leethargo on Feb 9, 2024 18:38:11 GMT
I also wanted to get a MIXCONSOLE for stereo outputs (currently mixing everything to mono with MIXER), but also wanted CV-controlled panning.
So, recently, when a used system was for sale, I considered getting a second MIXER module and using a combination of these for stereo mixing (first mix goes left, 2nd mix goes right).
If some sounds go hard-left or hard-right, I just need to use one of the 8 inputs. For those that move around, I'd use one input each, using qvca to invert the CV etc.
Not clear how to expand this system to more than 4 channels, except for nesting the mixers, and then maybe using the "B side" without level controls for the final mix.
Overall, I like the idea of "distributed mixing", using several small modules, but I'm also afraid that it will be all to easy to lose control, especially in a live situation ;-)
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pol
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Posts: 1,277
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Post by pol on Feb 10, 2024 19:59:39 GMT
I also wanted to get a MIXCONSOLE for stereo outputs (currently mixing everything to mono with MIXER), but also wanted CV-controlled panning. So, recently, when a used system was for sale, I considered getting a second MIXER module and using a combination of these for stereo mixing (first mix goes left, 2nd mix goes right). If some sounds go hard-left or hard-right, I just need to use one of the 8 inputs. For those that move around, I'd use one input each, using qvca to invert the CV etc. Not clear how to expand this system to more than 4 channels, except for nesting the mixers, and then maybe using the "B side" without level controls for the final mix. Overall, I like the idea of "distributed mixing", using several small modules, but I'm also afraid that it will be all to easy to lose control, especially in a live situation ;-) I have to say I have removed my Mixconsole purely because of the amount of rack real estate it uses, and how infrequently stereo matters within the AE. I usually just put the mono out into my external mixer, or MPC1 input which can make it stereo. I also have used the multifx stereo out when I'm using that module. An area I intend to explore more is using the 4I/Os module for 4 lots of audio to my external mixer on separate inputs on that. I used 3 when I did my track for Aetherwaves 5 last year. |
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Post by leethargo on Feb 11, 2024 12:17:41 GMT
Well, yes, if you already have an external mixer, then this makes sense.
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Post by rockysmalls on Feb 11, 2024 13:23:58 GMT
sorry, haven’t read this whole thread BUT... would be a great revision if the MixConsole had a switch to change the cv ins from level to panning!  robertlanger ? |
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Post by pt3r on Feb 12, 2024 9:02:33 GMT
My workaround so far has been to send stereo signals into to channels panned left and right, and to automate panning send my cv through a att/cv and send the output to level cv of the left channel and the inverted output to the level cv input of the right channel.
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Post by rockysmalls on Feb 12, 2024 17:10:34 GMT
My workaround so far has been to send stereo signals into to channels panned left and right, and to automate panning send my cv through a att/cv and send the output to level cv of the left channel and the inverted output to the level cv input of the right channel. hehe , yeah but that makes i 3 chan only but thats certainly enough to get some space action on the boil!  |
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