|
Post by jimread on Apr 26, 2022 19:46:10 GMT
Hello there, Phew! I was going to buy a Behringer System 100 bundle, found out the 112 oscillator was an old CD4046 design and didn't track very well. I was told that the new ones would, I've emailed a few stockists to ask for assurances, no reply. In my searches for an answer a post in this forum came up made by vitaliistep last year asking for advice, it was the replies that led me to join this forum. I went to Juno's site in the UK and made a list of AEM modules 3 VCO's 1 Seq 16 1 Wavefolder 1 Quad VCA 1 strings VCF 1 4 channel mixer console 1 Steiner VCF 1 S&H 1 AD dual 1 Dual LFO 2 state variable VCF 1 Master module 1 Headphone amp 1 AE Modular MULTIFX 1 2 row 12x2 narrow case Plus bus cables 18 Patch wires I would like to be able to use 3 voices to create tracks to accompany my videos. Any comments would be really appreciated. Cheers
|
|
|
Post by MaxRichardson97 on Apr 26, 2022 21:31:09 GMT
Hey Jim!
Pretty hefty system you got there. In all honesty, if you're a beginner - you really can't go wrong with the starter rack 2.
Those modules sound good, but for example, over 2 separate SV filters, I'd definitely choose more different types of filter.
If I were you, I'd say starter rack - and then take it from there! Although, maybe add a MultiFX to your starter rack budget if you can afford it?
Please shout if you have any questions!
Also, I would say that you're DEFINITELY going to need more than 18 patch wires!
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 26, 2022 22:04:51 GMT
Hello Max, Thanks for replying good of you. Apologies for not giving you some of my history re synths. I made a mono synth in the late 80's with a keyboard, couldn't play it gave to a band. Recently started and gave up on a DIY project, got TH VCO-1, TH VCO-555, and AS3340 VCO's working e.g. 555 I realised that the time I could allot to the project was too small to finish it this year. Thanks for saying 'these modules sound good' nice of you. I could only find two filters on the Juno site I would like to know if there are others, this is exactly the sort of information I need, thanks for that. Your right there are a fair number of modules but the price is still ever such a lot less than the System 100 bundle with 3 additions. I will order some more patch wires :-) Cheers [edit] I found the Delay modules on Juno will use 2 of those, saved a bit of dosh, listed under Tangible Waves and not AE Modular, must investigate those listings
|
|
|
Post by pt3r on Apr 27, 2022 5:22:51 GMT
Hey Jim! Pretty hefty system you got there. In all honesty, if you're a beginner - you really can't go wrong with the starter rack 2. Those modules sound good, but for example, over 2 separate SV filters, I'd definitely choose more different types of filter. If I were you, I'd say starter rack - and then take it from there! Although, maybe add a MultiFX to your starter rack budget if you can afford it? Please shout if you have any questions! Also, I would say that you're DEFINITELY going to need more than 18 patch wires! I will always advise to get a starter rack2 + MultiFX module + ( extra 2ENV and 2VCA if the budget allows it). When talking sequencer modules I would start with the SEQ8 and add another SEQ8 later on if more steps are needed instead of a SEQ16. As for patch cables my rule of thumb is one assorted set of cables per row of modules and add a pack of the extra long cables per extra rack. Cables are relatively inexpensive and it is a real bummer to see that you're missing one cable to finalize that patch you're working on.
|
|
|
Post by lukylutte on Apr 27, 2022 5:24:36 GMT
Good starting point but for 3 voices only 1 sequencer seems a bit limited. Maybe sample and hold and some logic could help. Also should check wonkystuff rbss (and all the other wonky modules).
Some modulation 2lfo, O_C, modulator....
Definitely, more patch wires 😉
A starter pack wouldn't be a mistake in any case...
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 27, 2022 7:51:03 GMT
Hello pt3rMany thanks for your advice Sadly Juno do not list the Starter Rack2 I did find SEQ8 on Juno but not in the AEM list, thanks for that I will buy 2. I'll look on Juno for the assorted cables, but I think they only sell them in single size bundles. I will add more thanks for the advice. Hello lukylutte Many thanks for your input I've altered my order to 2 dual VCO's and two dual LFO's I already did have a S&H on my list Sadly you didn't explain what O_C, Logic and Modulator means in the way of modules, I will buy a 2x20 box so perhaps I can add those later. Thanks both for your advice very good of you to do it. I'm going to place my order when I've finished writing this. The items I've added are still lots less expensive that the Behringer System 100 bundle and a few more modules. No doubt I'll be back with more questions I hope you don't mind. Kindest regards
|
|
|
Post by admin on Apr 27, 2022 8:23:54 GMT
Hi jimread, I understand that it's better to order from Juno due to the Brexit tax nightmare... However you should definitely check out the main website at tangiblewaves.com where all modules are presented and explained more thoroughly. Cheers, Carsten.
|
|
|
Post by keurslagerkurt on Apr 27, 2022 8:59:59 GMT
Oh, these Thomas Henry modules you built are supernice! But indeed, building a synth takes a looooong time. And an even looooonger time before it really becomes 'playable'. I hope to release a 555 spinoff module for AE later this year actually, because it sounds so great AE sounds great in general as well, and I don't know about what exactly Juno sells (you can always check out all the modules at the Tangible Waves website as well), but my favorite filter has to be the Wasp filter. Other than that, I think everyone here uttered already what I would add myself (eg. more patchcables!). I think, if you are worried about perfect tracking, you'll notice that the standard AE VCO does not track perfectly over >5 octaves. If you really want a perfectly tracking VCO, it will be best to look at a digital VCO (such as the modules FMOS, Sawvox, Wavetables). Anyway, welcome to AE!
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 27, 2022 11:24:11 GMT
Hello keurslagerkurt Thanks for the welcome good of you to do so. Your right about the DIY stuff I think one would have be a real electronics devotee to make a whole synth from scratch. I agree about the TH VCO-555 it does sound very good but is a complex build I found a single sided PCB layout and made that using the UV film method. I also found lots of PCB layouts that were the wrong size and had to measure and resize them in Photoshop. The other thing that bothered me was the amount of copper that needed to be removed, wasting the etch fluid. Photoshop took care of that as well e.g. From this; to this This would be inverted for the UV film method Which results in this This was the first one I did, now I can get the edges better using a hair drier. It worked every well first time. I have ordered two SEQ8's and two LoFi Delays from TW Juno had sold out and are rationing the patch wires. Kevin who lives over the road from us and makes model planes says he'll get me some cable and the 0.8mm plated plugs. I didn't buy the single VCO but two dual ones I think I'm right in saying that they track very well indeed. Thanks for the additional VCO suggestions I'll be looking into them as I progress. Cheers
|
|
|
Post by keurslagerkurt on Apr 27, 2022 12:46:52 GMT
Nice work on the oldschool PCB's! They look fascinating. I skipped the homebrew step and just drew some 2-sided PCB's & let them be manufactured for my first modules. I don't trust myself with chemicals & in general precision stuff For the 555 version I had great help from forum user m4vrick who drew a compact SMD pcb version and also assembled the SMD boards. It is indeed quite a big circuit and features a lot of different components. But it the end it also has everything you can ask from an analog VCO, really all the bells and whistles!
|
|
pol
Wiki Editors
Posts: 1,349
|
Post by pol on Apr 27, 2022 13:03:15 GMT
Hi jimread , I understand that it's better to order from Juno due to the Brexit tax nightmare... However you should definitely check out the main website at tangiblewaves.com where all modules are presented and explained more thoroughly. Cheers, Carsten. There is also a lot of information in the Wiki,
You can plan your rack in detail on
If you are intending getting a few modules/assessories at a time there is no problem ordering from Germany (cheaper, although will take a lot longer), just avoid going over £130 value and you'll be fine - I have done several orders since Brexit now, usually around the £100 mark to play it safe... Shipping is cheap enough to consider just buying 1 or 2 modules at a time. My understanding if you wanted a larger (over £130) you will pay UK VAT and an Admin fee around £30 on top of the price you pay at TW. I haven't tried that yet! Juno only stocks a small range, but is very quick to deliver (next day in one case for me!); there is a price premium but no shipping on top, headaches/worries/delays.... It is worth signing up to the "email me if the price drops" buttons on the modules on Juno as I have bought one when I was contacted and it had dropped £5, pretty good for a £40 module!
|
|
|
Post by dizzeesatchel on Apr 27, 2022 14:21:40 GMT
The O_C (or Ornament & Crime) is one of the newer TW modules, a port of a well-known Eurorack device which offers loads of modulation/CV generation opportunities. For example it can generate four interconnected but different LFOs, or envelopes; quantize signals, do sequencing or sample & hold duties! Very useful i think but also *very* deep and complex to learn. There's a thread elsewhere on this board about making your own cables, might be handy if Juno are rationing them! Juno AE stock seems to be running quite low so maybe they'll have a big order in soon
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 27, 2022 20:26:45 GMT
Hello pol Thanks for the information sadly the order I place this morning is over the limit. I have just sent, in case it hasn't already been shipped a message to TW asking to do a couple of things to get around it other wise 30 euros EU VAT (already paid) +£30 Admin handling +about £28 UK VAT. Such is life I'll know next time :-) Hello dizzeesatchel Thanks for the explanation of the O_C godness gracious worra module, I'll bear it in mind for later. I'm OK with making up leads and I've already got some heat shrink stuf, thanks for the link though. Juno are a very good company Charlie is a great bloke and very kindly cancelled an order of mine with the utmost politeness. Cheers both
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 14:14:24 GMT
Hello polI had made a mistake and put Germany in as my country, like a nerd, after a few emails and messages Robert sorted it out for me and cancelled my order. I will be able to order some in the same manner you do now. Thanks for the timely warning though I am grateful. Hello keurslagerkurtIt's just occurred to me that you will be using 0 to +5v for the VCO555 that in itself is a feat worthy of someone who who really knows what they are doing. I see the amount of components trebling up for single simple rail supply in a 741 OpAmp, let alone the quad ic's in the 555 fair play to you all. Hello adminApologies for missing your post, I have been to the TG site thanks for the heads up and looked at some of the modules I will be ordering some more and asking for advice some of them look a bit complex for me. Cheers all
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 15:35:53 GMT
Hello there, I am concerned about the connections and need some advice please. The Master module has P1 next to the Eurorack Bus and at the lower side P6 should the Red cable be adjacent to these. The modules, I see CN1 on the ones I've opened, am I correct in assuming that this means 'connection 1' which means the red cable adjacent to it and which I assume is the 5V one. Cheers
|
|
|
Post by pt3r on Apr 28, 2022 15:46:15 GMT
|
|
|
Post by dizzeesatchel on Apr 28, 2022 15:46:51 GMT
Don't use the Eurorack bus! That's only for connecting to euro systems which take more than 5v, the power supplied from that will fry TW modules. In Are modular land the bus cable always connects to the 5x2 pins in the lower right of the module. I don't think it matters whether the red strip is at the top of bottom (but someone correct me if wrong!) *I say lower right, it's lower left in your picture of course because they're lying face down
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 16:22:11 GMT
Hello pt3r I had looked at the video sadly it is no help whatsoever, it's aimed at the customers who bought a starter rack. Hello dizzeesatchel Thanks for that very helpful. Having plugged the Master in to the power supply and plugging in the bus cable with the Red end of the cable adjacent to the P6. With my multimeter I get the Red cable at 0v and the other end of the connection +5v. May I ask if someone can affirm that the Red cable should be 0v before I plug a module in please. Cheers Incidentally doing the same at P1 the Eurorack Bus I get exactly the same result as above.
|
|
|
Post by admin on Apr 28, 2022 16:29:00 GMT
As the cable connectors aren't keyed it's easy to install the cable upside down. Normally the red cable should be on the top. All power connectors for all AE modules are at the bottom. The wiki has more detail about the signal flow along the bus: wiki.aemodular.com/pmwiki.php/AeDiy/SignalsOnTheBusCable
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 16:49:09 GMT
Hello admin , The link you sent does say that the Red cable should be +5v thanks for that, but says nothing about the orientation of the connector. Sadly the 'on the top' is meaningless e.g. on the Master the connectors point in two different directions and so could be either. However the modules I've opened do have CN1 at one end presumably meaning connection one on the bus cable connectors. Should the Red cable at +5v be adjacent to the CN1? Can someone find out if this is correct if it is I will gladly take some close up pics that can be put in some literature for others to see. Cheers
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 17:29:45 GMT
Hello admin, Here's a close up pic that may explain it with a simple image. The RED cable is the +5v one and is "closer" to the top in both of these modules, on the left the Master and on the right a synth module. I would be very grateful if you could you see that this a/. correct and b/. is put somewhere that can be read by anyone and will save people like me asking in the future. I will put it on my blog/site that I am authoring: aemodular.blogspot.com/ Cheers
|
|
|
Post by pt3r on Apr 28, 2022 17:35:05 GMT
That is indeed the correct orientation. every module is connected the same way. The red stripe which is the 5V line is always oriented to the the top of the module. This is one thing that AE modular has improved upon compare to let's say eurorrack which has no standard orientation.
|
|
|
Post by jimread on Apr 28, 2022 17:48:28 GMT
Thanks pt3r, At last :-) Would it be possible to put the pic on the wiki where the cable details are. Thanks for the heads up about the Eurorack cobble up I'll put it on my site:-) Cheers and thanks a lot to you and to everyone else for your kind help
|
|
|
Post by keurslagerkurt on Apr 29, 2022 12:00:53 GMT
Might indeed be good to have this info instantly accessible somewhere. Your connections are right.
Fun thing by the way: you just have to be consistent with the cable orientation. If you connect it with the red stripe down for every module & bus, it will work just as well. This makes sense as in essence you just want to connect eg all the top right pins of modules with eachother. Or all the bottom pins.
|
|
|
Post by maydonpoliris on Apr 29, 2022 21:15:27 GMT
and for future reference the same goes with connecting 2 racks. top of one connects to top of the other. pt3r ridiculous that Eurorack does not have orientation as a standard, that would go wrong for sure.......
|
|