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Post by pt3r on Jan 28, 2022 8:59:28 GMT
.and I'm out of jail. Facebook jail that is.  I got my account limited for a whole month for pointing out the similarities in the moral ambiguity connected to listening to the music of Burzum and Michael Jackson. One is a fascist xenophobe who murdered a fellow musician and makes records while the other one was a child abuser making records. Can a listener separate the author and the work or are we morally obliged to consider both? What about Phil Spector who was a murderer but also a very successful record producer. Or Spotify which provides an exclusive platform to anti-vax madness spokesperson Joe Rogan. How far must we consider our moral responsibility when consuming? An observation I was clearly not allowed to make on facebook without getting banned and being painted a fascist. I still think it's an interesting topic. How do you feel about it? Meanwhile fascists are allowed to run their petty little hate groups on facebook without any problem. Questions, questions, questions... For the record I'm not a fascist and I don't mean to offend anyone. I'm just asking a question and got 'cancelled' by some crude facebook algorithm. |
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Post by tIB on Jan 28, 2022 12:45:38 GMT
I don't think it's about 'we', but 'you' - different strokes for different folks.
For example, I've never used Spotify as I don't agree with how much it pays the artists. I love Phil Spector's production, and while I can't stand the bloke, there are some earlier Jackson records I can still appreciate. I can also think of a million other artists who I have despised for doing nothing wrong other than release awful music that lots of people fawn over.
TLDR it's not easy to make great music, so anyone who can deserves my respect for that, alone regardless of who or what they've touched, snorted or murdered. YMMV and I can respect that.
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Post by tIB on Jan 28, 2022 12:46:10 GMT
Oh, and don't get me started on Facebook - I don't use that either.
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Post by maydonpoliris on Jan 28, 2022 12:46:15 GMT
whilst I don't use facebook I don't think you should have been limited for asking that question. Actually a good question really.
Its a hard topic to answer. I've been toiling over this one.
My easy and preferred answer is I personally think we should be morally obliged to consider both
and one I generally adhere to....... as much as one can....
I think as a society if it doesn't truly effect us personally then we kind of only see what we like from something and ignore everything else.
There are so many artists, figure heads, sports stars, companies etc that are horrible people, have done horrible things or that are just have terrible traits and yet still get applauded/supported for their work.
Does it depend on the scale?
Convicted?, rumours? media hype? what do we believe or should we believe?
Have I danced/sung/bought albums and been influenced by say someone like Jackson back in the day sure have.
Have I listened to a song of his on the radio since knowing what happened, yes
Have I listened to a bought album...no.
Would I have supported him in the past knowing back then, absolutely not.
Do I wish now that I didn't enjoy/be influenced by his musical talent in the past.......probably no......so in writing this does that make me a hypocrite even though its one of the worst crimes you can commit.......probably yes.....
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pol
Wiki Editors
Posts: 1,356
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Post by pol on Jan 28, 2022 21:48:04 GMT
Oh, and don't get me started on Facebook - I don't use that either. Me neither, wouldn't sign the new privacy policy as it meant you/your device(s) didn't have any! |
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Post by Mafic_Pulse on Feb 2, 2022 2:22:37 GMT
My friend is a person of color that loves Burzum. His take is ~Varg would hate it if he knew how much I love his music and I find that delightfully hilarious...but F that guy~
Separating the monsters from their art is difficult but I think I've come to realize there is no correct answer to some of these difficult questions.
The freedom of speech question is difficult. I used to love listening to Rogan because he'd have people like Neil DeGrasse Tyson and Bernie Sanders on and give them equal respect as other guests. Unfortunately, I think he has stepped to the wrong side of logic and decency. So should he be cancelled for a (wrong) opinion? Sometimes I think yes - other times (as a US citizen) I think that freedom of speech, no matter how insane the opinion may be is "sacred". Because if the crazies become the majority I still want to be able to express myself without being cancelled.
Also, how many people on this forum are into metal? I saw a djent post!
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Post by pt3r on Feb 2, 2022 10:18:06 GMT
Freedom of speech is IMO fundamental, unfortunately the crazies defending their xenophobic racist BS in the name of freedom of speech would more than likely limit your freedom of speech once they get into power. Anyway I'll stop the politics back to the music.
I am quite into metal, over the year my taste progressed a bit more towards the prog/djent side of metal lie Meshuggah or Animals As Leaders but also a big fan of (relatively) older stuff like Shai Hulud, Lightbearer, Psyopus and Five Star Prison Cell. And I will always have a soft spot for the oldschool (sXe) hardcore bands like S.O.I.A and Gorilla Biscuits.
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Post by tIB on Feb 2, 2022 12:11:43 GMT
Having reflected on this further I think it's somewhat hilarious that I have far more hatred for the likes of Maroon 5 than I do a convicted murderer. The human condition is broken.
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Post by pt3r on Feb 2, 2022 12:16:02 GMT
Having reflected on this further I think it's somewhat hilarious that I have far more hatred for the likes of Maroon 5 than I do a convicted murderer. The human condition is broken. |
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Post by Mafic_Pulse on Feb 3, 2022 3:23:08 GMT
Having reflected on this further I think it's somewhat hilarious that I have far more hatred for the likes of Maroon 5 than I do a convicted murderer. The human condition is broken. This made me laugh quite loud! |
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Post by Mafic_Pulse on Feb 3, 2022 3:30:44 GMT
Freedom of speech is IMO fundamental, unfortunately the crazies defending their xenophobic racist BS in the name of freedom of speech would more than likely limit your freedom of speech once they get into power. Anyway I'll stop the politics back to the music. I am quite into metal, over the year my taste progressed a bit more towards the prog/djent side of metal lie Meshuggah or Animals As Leaders but also a big fan of (relatively) older stuff like Shai Hulud, Lightbearer, Psyopus and Five Star Prison Cell. And I will always have a soft spot for the oldschool (sXe) hardcore bands like S.O.I.A and Gorilla Biscuits. Meshuggah is one of my favorite bands, the Chaosphere album in particular is one of my favorite albums ever. I haven't thought about Psyoous in forever, I need to listen to them again. When my AE modular system arrives I hope to make dark ambient music with the vibe of Sunn 0))) hopefully it's going to ship soon, I got an email from Robert that they're going to assemble it. I haven't felt like a kid awaiting Christmas in a very long time - but this is definitely that feeling! |
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Post by pt3r on Feb 3, 2022 7:55:10 GMT
I don't know what setup you ordered but I can guarantee that it can take you straight into the abyss and beyond.  |
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Post by dizzeesatchel on Feb 3, 2022 10:54:40 GMT
Freedom of speech is IMO fundamental, unfortunately the crazies defending their xenophobic racist BS in the name of freedom of speech would more than likely limit your freedom of speech once they get into power. Anyway I'll stop the politics back to the music. I am quite into metal, over the year my taste progressed a bit more towards the prog/djent side of metal lie Meshuggah or Animals As Leaders but also a big fan of (relatively) older stuff like Shai Hulud, Lightbearer, Psyopus and Five Star Prison Cell. And I will always have a soft spot for the oldschool (sXe) hardcore bands like S.O.I.A and Gorilla Biscuits. When my AE modular system arrives I hope to make dark ambient music with the vibe of Sunn 0))) Ooh you should check out this excellent droney AE jam from namke ! |
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Post by Mafic_Pulse on Feb 4, 2022 3:16:21 GMT
When my AE modular system arrives I hope to make dark ambient music with the vibe of Sunn 0))) Ooh you should check out this excellent droney AE jam from namke ! This is fantastic! Thanks! |
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